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Why do you respect Joe the plumber and not Jose the lawnmower? Joe may dress more professionally and speak better English, but it doesn’t mean he is above Jose. People like Jose understand entrepreneurship and business, which is why he will surpass Joe the plumber when it comes to net worth.
- Jose has a harder work ethic than Joe. Instead of working 40 hours weeks like Joe, Jose tries to work at least 70 hours so that his kids can have a better education.
- Joe enjoys going out and having fun, which isn’t a bad thing, but Jose saves his money for his family and retirement.
- After a hard days work Joe likes to watch CNN and see where the presidential debate is. Jose on the other hand is working so that one-day he has enough money to buy CNN.
- When things go wrong in life Joe gets depressed and hides out in his house. Jose on the other hand is always grateful for what he has and keeps moving forward in life. Instead of whining like Joe, he is trying to solve his problems.
- And the best part about Jose is that he may make less per hour than Joe, but at the end of the day he is making more because he pays no taxes.
Who would you rather be? Joe the plumber or Jose the lawnmower man?
Completely awesome Neil! Haha! That last bit about paying no taxes was great. Seriously though you make some really good points here about the strengths of Jose’s culture.
Sadly I haven’t figured out how to pay no taxes like Jose.
I’d call that just about the worst parable ever. Seriously.
All right..Jose is representing all the immigrants out there. Hey legal or illegal, Jose is a hard worker for sure.
Yep, he represents everyone. It doesn’t matter if you are Mexican, Indian,…. he represents all of us.
That’s what I’m talkin’ about! Go Jose the Lawnmower!
Yep! And on the weekends when he is free you will see him as a construction worker. Jose is definitely a hard worker.
Heck Yeah. Jose has the long term future in his mind, while Joe is thinking short term- that trip to the bar for $10 wings and beer.
10 dollars a day adds up. Jose tries to conserve his cash when possible.
Errr.. talk about flawed logic:
1. It sure would be nice if we only had to work 40. Joe’s work longer than anyone else in the industrialized world:
http://archives.cnn.com/2001/CAREER/trends/08/30/ilo.study/
2. Jose saves his money. Joe spends it and thereby reinvests in the economy. Because he spends money, the company he works for makes more money, because other Joes are spending too. Joe then gets a raise because his company can afford it. Jose is still mowing lawns for $7/hour at the age of 55…
3. I know of no Jose at the head of a major broadcasting network.
4. When things go wrong in Joe’s life he becomes a recluse and blames republicans. When things go wrong in Jose’s life he starts pushing dope and eventually gets deported.
5. Yep, nothing like Joe footing the bill for Jose’s kids to go to get medical treatment and an education. Most likely helping to pay for Jose’s 2 kids that are locked up as well.
Thanks for sharing! I know Joe’s job isn’t easy and he is helping the economy, but I think we can all learn from both of them. There are good and bad things about both of them, we just have to learn from the bad and follow the good things.
1. Joe isn’t the VP of a telecom company. Try getting a plumber on Sunday during the football games. Lots of Joe’s work closer to the 40.
2. Saving $ whether it be in a bank or in stocks is essentially re-investing in the economy as well. Banks loan your deposits out to others, and companies are public to unlock economic value in their companies. Even if Jose still mows lawns for $7/hour till 55, he can then retire at 55 and give himself a raise w/ his retirement account. 37 years at a conservative 7%; all he needs is about 11 - 12% of his income saved each month - which can be done.
3. Yet. No reason Jose can’t create a network and in 37 years it could grow into something huge while he is still mowning. He could certainly found something w/ minimal investment, build it with time and when it generates $ turn daily ops over to a business professional.
4. Take a major event like losing a job - Jose can then walk into any fast food place or open the newspaper and find an equivalent job nearly immediately. Turning to pushing would take a lot more time and effort.
5. Even if Jose did pay taxes, Joe’s would still be subsidizing the vast majority of services for Jose anyway. Paying taxes on $7 x 70 won’t equate to the amount necessary for those services. If married w/ 2 kids he would only be on the hook for about $1200 of federal taxes. State, local, and others would be much less. Also, any sales tax that goes to basic services is already being paid by Jose.
You make a good point about paying taxes. Even if it isn’t income tax, he still pays taxes when he buys goods from a store.
Not paying income tax is shameful. Taxes on goods and property taxes isn’t “a good point”. If Jose wants to enjoy the benefits of the country, he shouldn’t do so by taking advantage of law abiding citizens.
Hopefully there is a #6 where Jose gets the appropriate punishment for intentionally breaking the law.
I agree. If you want to enjoy the benefits of the country you should pay taxes. The question is, if you make tons of money should your tax bracket be higher?
My name is Jose, what do you think about this…
What about all the people in this country that take advantage of Jose? People exploiting his desire and willingness to work harder than white america and paying the $7 per hr you’re talking about.
Where would this country be without the Mexicans?
Probably paying $10 per orange or strawberry since no other ethnicity will work under those conditions or for those wages. And I can go on and on.
Some of the comments are retarded.
I don’t think everyone exploits Jose. There are some people out there that actually care about him and pay him well.
im’ with you jose.
i’d laugh at america if there were no mexicans.
people don’t see what REALLY goes on to put food on people’s tables
Not all Mexicans are illegals and not all of them have low paying jobs.
Wow I sense some racism in this comment. Anyway, the problem with this post is that it 100% utilizing stereotypes. Trying to sum up socioeconomic demographics into two imaginary people is inherently flawed from the get go.
I could be wrong, but I don’t think anyone here is a racist against Joe or Jose. People are just opinionated.
Jose here. I beg to differ.
I completely agree Sean. I sense it too.
My father, Jose as well, is a gardner. He worked his butt off. Payed taxes and now he owns a house and has no debt.
I worked with him as a kid and white America though I did not know how to speak English. You would be surprised what I hear people say. As a 11 year old kid, I was in shock about what I head and experienced. All this time I carried this knowledge, I could not share it with my family because I didn’t want them to feel what I felt. Some people are ignorant and have no shame.
Even till this day, when people that don’t know me hear my name, they start to treat me differently.
I now have a successful career, make a grip load of cash, have multiple businesses and pay a shit load of taxes.
All this hustle, I learned from my father and uncles. They were gardeners, but they had their own business and made their rules, had money in their pockets, and now have no debt.
See that is the thing I want people to get from all the Jose’s out there. Many of them own their own business, set their own rules, and aren’t in debt. Plus they instill good values on their kids.
I can swear there was a study conducted a few years back on the average take home pay for a homeless person who actively begs in high traffic areas… and - with no taxes - it was around $36K.. parlay that with a little bumvertising (bumvertising.com) , and you’re creeping towards some nice coin.
I find that hard to believe. I watched a documentary on homeless people and I think they said a few do well but most do not.
I think you’re thinking about fulltime pan-handlers. I used to work in Brentwood a few years back, and I remember seeing some well-off homeless people. One guy used to wander around with his shopping cart, but when he pulled out his wallet, he would have a thick wad of cash. I remember another guy was a “homeless” scammer. He made people believe that he was homeless, but in fact, he just dressed up as a bum and asked people for money.
This represents a very small portion of the homeless community I believe. Most homeless people live in bad conditions and have no money. And with the little money that they scrounge up, they use for food, alcohol, or drugs.
I knew a few homeless people. One of them begged for food and a place to stay. Another one begged for martial arts classes and the other begged money to buy food and book. All three are doing extremely well now.
My favorite homeless people are the ones that tell jokes. I’ll gladly give them a buck if they can make me laugh.
There are homeless people who make more than some 9 to 5 workers. I believe there was a news expose on how homeless people make tons of money off celebrities.
If I had to pick between the two it would be Joe the Plumber. Deport Jose!
I don’t like tax money paying for illegal immigrants anymore than you do, but the reality is Jose the Lawnmower works hard, and he takes jobs that many citizens wouldn’t even think about doing.
Plus, I don’t think this blog post is about whether or not Jose is an illegal.
It’s more about the symbolism of the two individuals. One works hard, barely makes enough to get by, raises a family, and still manages to save some money. The other one makes more money, but still complains that he doesn’t have enough.
Now I ask you…who is more noble?
“One works hard, barely makes enough to get by”… on the backs of the Joes, who pay more in taxes to subsidize everything that Jose takes advantage of… like health care, like education, like a million other things. Jose represents the unskilled labor portion of our social class system, who is forced to work hard because he is unskilled. Once Jose becomes skilled, then he becomes a Joe. Joe is just a 3rd generation Jose, whose ancestors built the foundation that we have.
Bob,
Being a plumber isn’t exactly rocket science. How much skill does a plumber need?
You know a lot of Joses are good at construction as well. They don’t only mow lawns.
They can do anything from mowing lawns to running a billion dollar company.
Huh? Racism? This post has nothing to do with racism. There are two classes defined here, one is Joe, who represents the skilled labor of the American economy (or at least the more skilled than Jose), and Jose, who represents the unskilled portion. If Jose gets an education, or job training, he becomes a Joe… it has nothing to do with race, and everything to do with skills.
@Mark Saving your money is not the equivalent of spending it, and is not an equal reinvestment back into the economy. It’s why we have an index on consumer spending.. and why when consumers don’t reinvest in the economy, people pull their money out of companies. You never hear something about consumers saving more money and the stock market shooting up. It works nearly the opposite of how you have written. Consumer spends money, business creates jobs, increases wages, and pays employees more, who turn around and invest AND spend their money.
Lastly, show me a Jose making 12% and I’ll sell you a piece of property… well. you know the rest.
I’d say plumbers have greater skill set that takes longer to master than does that of an SEO.
I wouldn’t know because I am not a plumber. I think that is a hard call to make unless you have been an SEO and a plumber.
I don’t think Jose will turn into Joe. His kids may, but I think his experiences in life will keep him different. I am not saying this is a good or a bad thing, but that I don’t think they will be the same.
Of course Jose won’t turn into Joe.. as you said, he saves his money, he doesn’t reinvest it in his own education. I’ll quote myself:
“Jose is still mowing lawns for $7/hour at the age of 55…”
and here:
“Joe is just a 3rd generation Jose, whose ancestors built the foundation that we have.”
There are exceptions to the rule, but there is no way to discuss the meat of this topic without generalizing.
Yes in general you are correct. I could be a bit biased because I know a lot of Jose’s that are successful.
By the same token, what you said here isn’t accurate:
“They can do anything from mowing lawns to running a billion dollar company.”
Jose by definition can’t run a billion dollar company, because “Jose” is defined as his class… not even Joe can… that’s another class altoghter… that’s the class William, who has eclipsed both Jose and Joe.
If Jose found himself at the head of a billion dollar company, he would no longer be classified as Jose.. he would be a William
You are right, at that point he isn’t a Jose anymore. He is wearing $10,000 suits and owns a private jet.
Bob Dole is a doosh…LOL
I bet this bob dole doesn’t even know anyone that runs a billion dollar company.
just reads about it…
I don’t think most people know of someone who runs a billion dollar company.
A third generation Jose would be my son. And I’m second generation and leaps and bounds above a Plumber.
A history of Joe in action:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Median_household_income
Don’t blame Joe for complaining he doesn’t have enough… Jose is doing the same thing, which is why he’s trying to better his situation.
Steve, you are correct. It really wasn’t about being an immigrant or not, instead I was using them to prove a point.
You prick.
Now, this is a tough one, I would have gone for Joe but Joe the lawnmower still has a lot up his sleeves.
Nice
Yea, it is hard to pick one. I prefer Jose, but Joe also has some great qualities.
6. The second best part is that Jose probably supports Barack Obama because he knows if he elects John McCain legal American’s will take his job because there won’t be any other ones left other than field jobs.
LOL! Hopefully Jose is a US citizen so he can vote.
To be honest, I rather be Ricardo the pool cleaner. That way while Joe the Plumber is out whining about taxes, I’m cuddled up with his wifey getting fed grapes that his heard earned plumbing dollars bought.
Who says Jose isn’t doing the same thing. Why do you think Jose doesn’t wear a shirt while cutting grass.
LOL! You’re crazy…
Wow, I think we should all leave the social commentary to more qualified experts. While the post makes a point, but hardly valid.
Jose is never going to make it and that’s the underlying harsh reality.
1) Working 70 hours, he does not have time to develop his mind as a pure laborer. His kids are working alongside with him, and never getting the proper education.
2) 70 hours x $4.25 an hour, Jose has no savings and no pension and no social security since you said he pays no taxes.
3) Jose will never be able to network with the good old boys. Owning a stake of a national brand is out of the question.
4) False, Jose will get depressed also and may lead to more destructive acts than Joe.
5) Terrible closing logic. No taxes, means no social security, no pension, and no retirement. Jose can’t vote, and can’t buy a house. Jose will be forever working as migrant workers taking up all the crap jobs that no one wants.
It is scary how Americans actually fear Joses benefiting from the US system when they are denied everything possible from the start making their life a living hell.
Think about it. How else could have so many people who literally don’t have common sense put Bush up for a 2nd term.
This comment is dead on.
I just looked in the police blotter for today and yesterday there were more than 3 DWI/DUI cases all on illegal immigrants. Jose can’t handle the pressure and hits the bottle to try and release some steam.
I disagree. Illegal immigrants run into problems but who says they can’t be successful in life. I am not saying it is a good or a bad thing that they are illegal immigrants, but that doesn’t determine if they will be successful.
Many Joses drink alot - both in quantity and frequency. Everyone needs to stop drinking and driving; not just the illegals.
I totally agree. I love drinking but you have to be a responsible drunk.
The biggest drunks I’ve ever meet have not been illegals, or you mean Mexicans.
I think the biggest irresponsible drunks are teenagers.
I know a Jose who actually made it. He started off by doing unskilled work and now he is pulling in 300k a year. Anything is possible!
Yep, I’m not far behind.
Glad to here. Best of luck!
1. That is 70 hours of prime mind development time. I am always thinking of ideas when I mow. Jose has 70 hours a week to put in a learn Chinese, learn English, calculus, etc. tape and practice. Noone can hear you practice your chinese over the roar of a lawn mower. He could also find 2 - 4 hours a day to implement any idea given 10 hours for eating & sleeping.
2. I certainly am not counting on social security. It might not exist by the time I am 65. Jose can certainly save 11-12% of his income and still retire w/ a raise by 55. I lived on much less than that while in college ($5/hour x 25 hours/week). Jose would get nearly 1200/month. plenty to pay 200 or so in rent, 500 in food and other, and saving 200.
3. Who knows. Maybe Jose mows for the CEO and one day over lunch the CEO overhears him talking Chinese to the gardener and the next day talking English to the Butler, and the next day describing a great idea to the Maid. The CEO being the smart guy he is, sees the talent in the young Jose, and the ball starts rolling. Afterall, a patent clerk would never be able to break into the scientific community either right?
4. Subjective - anyone can come up w/ an alternative scenario. Although, Neil has already established Jose as a man w/ strong work ethic and character. I was laid off from a $5/hour job once, and had another w/in a week on the other side of the state making twice as much.
5. He can still have retirement w/o a pension, or social security. 401K/IRA is different than pension. I was under the impression foreign nationals could buy property in the US (even though it doesn’t really have anything to do w/ retirement).
It is amazing where you can get to because of networking. If you do grunt work for a high powered individual (such as a CEO), it can go a long way.
Jose’s can’t be successful? How do you define success? Success means different things to different people.
I guess I’m too naive not to believe things are possible for anything with an idea, a little bit of ambition, and a strong worth ethic.
I define Jose as an immigrant. He doesn’t have to be Hispanic… just an immigrant.
I think the overall point is valid, in that we all need to just buckle down and bust it out rather than whine, complain, or feel like we’re entitled to anything.
I don’t think the Jose’s of the world, for the most, typically amount to much financially or business-wise, for the reasons already mentioned. They’re too busy running the rat race to ever get out of the maze. If they had the time, education, and mental capacity to devise a vision for a business, their work-ethic and willingness to just get it done would carry them far.
However that’s usually not going to happen and they’ll bust their hump their whole lives to scrape by.
Yes, not all of them are going to succeed. But if we can learn to bust our ass like Jose, we will be better off.
Yup.. that’s the point, if our skilled workers adopt Jose’s work-ethic, and really apply themselves full-force, there is no limit to what we can achieve. However, a lot of the middle class is just comfortable enough to where they aren’t motivated to really get out there and innovate. The rich (born rich, not self made) aren’t really motivated to do much because they’re already rich. The poor (Jose’s of the world) or those without a lot of resources have the biggest motivation to succeed, but for the most part lack the resources (finances, connections, opportunities, etc) to ever really reach their potential.
Again, none of this applies to everyone.. it’s truly not a matter of resources, but of resourcefulness. If the will is strong enough, there is a way to get it done and make it happen. Most don’t have the fortitude to stick to it though and drive it all the way home.
“If they had the time, education, and mental capacity to devise a vision for a business”
What the “F” I know some gardeners that have a high education and are brilliant in their country. Once they come to the States looking for the dream they get a rude awakening.
As far as mental capacity, you could not be more wrong. I went to school in Mexico and they have higher standards than the schools here.
The same thing happens with many of the people in my family. Even though they are highly educated in India, it doesn’t really do much for them in the states. Because of this they either have to go back to school or do whatever it takes to make a decent living.
Today’s crisis is hurting immigrants hard.
I never liked the US Immigration policy! Look how great Canada is managing immigrants.
I would respect Jose.
Problem with this post is that it was written from an American point of view.
The thing with Canada is that it borders the US. Both countries are well off and it isn’t like most US citizens want to move to Canada.
Complicated issue. Obviously, hard work and thrift are to be applauded, and there’s no question that immigrants to the US have historically achieved and succeeded to an extraordinary extent.
But as another commenter mentioned, the future belongs to knowledge workers (at at least, VERY highly skilled craftsmen) so the key issue is not the extent to which Jose succeeds. Instead, we need to look at his kids, and how they will take advantage of the opportunities America offers.
Exactly! His kids are likely to have a hard work ethic and be skilled. This will lead them to be successful.
if Jose isnt related to Charles Keating the convicted felon and bank fraudster, like joe the plumber is, then he really has no business in this election.
We need to focus on more substantial ways for fortune 500 CEOs to get another $700,000 personal tax cut while middle class americans making less than $250,000 can be taxed even MORE heavily by McCain when he steals the election with vote fraud machines.
I think middle class Americans make a lot less than 250k. I could be wrong, but that seems really high. I would even say that they make less than 120k.
I really hope we don’t see another election like in 2000. There was too many shady things going on in that election. Gore should’ve won.
Yea, we need change. I hate paying taxes, but I don’t like the economy going to shit.
Without the Jose’s of the world, the US economy would crumble.
I don’t know if the US would crumble, but they do a lot of jobs that many of us would not touch.
Maybe not the US, but big agricultural states like California and Washington would have difficulty getting product to market, prices would increase and all Americans could be hurt.
If product prices increase, that would mean companies would make more money. And when companies make more money, they’ll either increase salaries or create more jobs. Of course, this is the ideal scenario.
We’ve all seen how corrupt corporate America can be. =[
Corporate America would probably increase their profit margins and not pay more. Look at the oil companies.
US Economy wouldn’t crumble but I assure you a lot of people would be HUNGRY!! LOL that’s real talk too
I doubt it would crumble, but it would get hurt.
Hey Neil, Amount of middle class families would be very less in US. The major reason to crumble US economy is unwanted threat which people of US and all around the world feel.
I would of course prefer to become Jose the Lawnmower Man! Great stuff Neil.
Same here. I hate paying taxes…